Hi,

I am still new to the *BSD world, but hopefully I will include most of the
relevant
information regarding my issue.  If not, please forgive me. :)

I have just done a fresh install of OpenBSD 4.3 (i386, AthlonXP 1800+, so
not that old
of hardware) which is running properly with one exception:  the system
pauses at boot
time after selecting what partition/kernel to load and waits for any key to
be pressed.
After pressing any key, the machine boots and functions properly.

I see the following after the bootloader timeout expires:

booting hd0a:/bsd: 5913424+1004644 [52+306864+287943]=0x72a4d4
entry point at 0x200120

At which point the system waits.  It sits indefinitely until any key is
pressed.

/etc/boot.conf contains "set timeout 10".  If I type any valid command into
the boot
prompt, the system loads the kernel and boots normally.  It only hangs if
the loader
selects the kernel itself.  Additionally, it hangs even when I specify a
partition
to use in boot.conf (bsd, bsd.rd, even the bootable CD do the same thing).

I have also reinstalled completely as well as recompiled the kernel/system
from CVSup.

I am getting the feeling that this is some simple issue that I have missed,
but nothing
has come up with any of my internet/list archive searches.  Anyone else with
the issue
seems to have a system that is unresponsive following the "entry point..."
line.

I don't plan on having a display or keyboard attached to this machine, so it
would be
convenient to not have to physically interact with it on each boot.

Sorry for the length.  I hope I have included all necessary information, my
dmesg
output is below.

Best regards,
Ryan Smith

dmesg output:
(pseudo device)
454 ppp count 1 (pseudo device)
455 sl count 1 (pseudo device)
--- more ---            456 tun count 1 (pseudo device)
457 vlan count 1 (pseudo device)
458 trunk count 1 (pseudo device)
459 pppoe count 1 (pseudo device)
460 bio count 1 (pseudo device)
461 pctr count 1 (pseudo device)
462 ...
[ message continues ]

The default install don't have these.

May be stupid to ask, but did you try without your boot.conf file?

 From the FaQ a bit lower from it

http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq6.html#PXE

"Note that /etc/boot.conf is only needed if the kernel you wish to boot 
from is not named bsd, or other pxeboot defaults are not as you need 
them (for example, you wish to use a serial console). You can test your 
tftpd(8) server using a tftp(1) client, making sure you can fetch the 
needed files."

Does it go well without it?

Best,

Daniel

[ message continues ]

Thanks for the reply Daniel.

I should have noted that the machine did the same thing on initial boot
(lacking boot.conf).  Currently, boot.conf only increases the timeout;
it does the same thing with or without a kernel being specified in
boot.conf.  If I type in a kernel to use at the bootloader prompt, it
will boot normally without the delay.

Best regards,
Ryan Smith

-----Original Message-----
From: Daniel Ouellet [mailto:daniel@presscom.net] 
Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 4:43 PM
To: Ryan Smith
Cc: misc@openbsd.org
Subject: Re: 4.3 Bootloader waiting for keypress before loading kernel

into

The default install don't have these.

May be stupid to ask, but did you try without your boot.conf file?

 From the FaQ a bit lower from it

http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq6.html#PXE

"Note that /etc/boot.conf is only needed if the kernel you wish to boot 
from is not named bsd, or other pxeboot defaults are not as you need 
them (for example, you wish to use a serial console). You can test your 
tftpd(8) server using a tftp(1) client, making sure you can fetch the 
needed files."

Does it go well without it?

Best,

Daniel

[ message continues ]

And you did it (without the boot.conf), not on your own compile version, 
but on the stable distribution one as the system you run now if your own 
compile version:

OpenBSD 4.3-stable (GENERIC) #0: Thu Aug 14 09:15:48 CDT 2008
     root@ryan-router.austin.rr.com:/usr/src/sys/arch/i386/compile/GENERIC

<snip>

You didn't try to make changes on the default kernel, some optimization, 
removing drivers, or what not right?

And your root / partition is not a multi GB in size, just in case right?

[ message continues ]

You could always try this.

As Nick explain before in the archive. This usually should work no 
problem, unless there is a keyboard switch in the path or something 
similar, witch you do not right?

http://archives.neohapsis.com/archives/openbsd/2005-01/2830.html

Anyway, as you say your system boot if you enter, or press a key, you 
can always just try this and see

echo "boot" > /etc/boot.conf

But I would try without the keyboard connected and see and also make 
sure your BIOS do not have the wait on keyboard if error setup. Just a 
thought there as well. Not sure about your bios, but some old one did 
have this in there and if not setup properly, just wait on keyboard error.

So, try without a keyboard and also try the above echo to see.

After that, if it still doesn't work, may be someone else may have a 
better suggestion for you.

But I would think that would be the source of the problem, but I could 
be wrong. Is your keyboard is USB type by any chance? Not that it should 
make a difference, but if so, may be you have something else connected 
there that give you the problem.

Best,

Daniel

[ message continues ]

Daniel Ouellet:
<snip>
You didn't try to make changes on the default kernel, some optimization,
removing drivers, or what not right?

And your root / partition is not a multi GB in size, just in case right?
</snip>

My root partition is 10GB in size, following the recommendation of
openbsd101.com.  I have had no other problems with other operating systems,
but perhaps I was just getting lucky with the bootloader being loaded in the
appropriate region for the BIOS.  I will try reinstalling with a smaller
root.

<snip>
echo "boot" > /etc/boot.conf

But I would try without the keyboard connected and see and also make 
sure your BIOS do not have the wait on keyboard if error setup. Just a 
thought there as well. Not sure about your bios, but some old one did 
have this in there and if not setup properly, just wait on keyboard error.

...

But I would think that would be the source of the problem, but I could 
be wrong. Is your keyboard is USB type by any chance? Not that it should 
make a difference, but if so, may be you have something else connected 
there that give you the problem.
</snip>

The BIOS seems happy to boot without a keyboard attached (which is PS/2).
It proceeds to load the boot loader where it hangs in the same place, but
this time, I can't press any keys to get it to continue loading. :)

I also tried eliminating the timeout with "boot" in boot.conf, but I still
have this issue, with or without a keyboard being attached.

[ message continues ]

what is openbsd101.com? nevermind, don't answer.

you might consider reading the install documentation supplied with the  
product you're installing though.

ftp://ftp.openbsd.org/OpenBSD/4.3/i386/INSTALL.i386

Ben

[ message continues ]

You have assumed that because I have used some resource for new users that I
have not read any of the official documentation.  This would be untrue.  In
fact, INSTALL.i386 was the first thing I read while grabbing the ISO, but
since I have had no problems with a larger bootable partition with Linux, I
anticipated no problems with the larger partition sizes recommended on the
aforementioned website.  The minimum partition sizes from the FAQ are for a
substantially smaller hard drive, and, obviously, scaling the sizes by the
almost order of magnitude of difference would not have been a good idea.

There are other supplemental resources out there, and not all of them are
bad.

Thanks anyway.

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-misc@openbsd.org [mailto:owner-misc@openbsd.org] On Behalf Of
Ben Calvert
Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2008 6:34 PM
To: Ryan Smith
Cc: misc@openbsd.org
Subject: Re: 4.3 Bootloader waiting for keypress before loading kernel


what is openbsd101.com? nevermind, don't answer.

you might consider reading the install documentation supplied with the  
product you're installing though.

ftp://ftp.openbsd.org/OpenBSD/4.3/i386/INSTALL.i386

Ben

[ message continues ]

OpenBSD is not Linux.

http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq4.html#Install
http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#LargeDrive

What was lacking about the official resources that the supplemental
ones provided?

--david

[ message continues ]

I am aware that OpenBSD is not Linux and never made the assertion that they
were the same.  That's the reason I am trying to use OpenBSD and not Linux;
it is more suited for what I am eventually wanting to do.

I wasn't trying to say "it works in Linux, so why doesn't it work in
OpenBSD?"  I understand they are different, but I also understand that the
BIOS is the defining factor in the bootable partition size limitation.  For
that reason, it is not unreasonable to expect that if I have a 10gb
partition in "XYZ" operating system (insert "Linux") and the BIOS still
allows booting from this partition regardless of where the bootloader and
kernel falls, the BIOS probably will continue to allow me to boot on a
similarly-sized partition with another operating system.  If the BIOS will
address n-gb for XYZ operating system, it is unlikely to refuse to address
that size for OpenBSD.

There was nothing lacking in the official documentation.  Additionally, the
supplemental documentation actually didn't provide very much; most of the
OpenBSD stuff I have found is just summarized documentation or verbatim
manpages.  But if we followed the logic of "if it's not the official
documentation, it's no good," there would be no reason for having mailing
lists or fora either.  The documentation included in the manpages is
fantastic, easily the best that I've ever seen with an OS; but as a new user
to the *BSD systems, it can be overwhelming at first, and sometimes a
dumbed-down guide is a nice preface for a dumbed-down user like myself.

Anyway, I dropped the root partition size to <1gb and did clean install, but
still this issue prevails.  I have been through the BIOS settings time and
again and haven't found any setting that would be causing this, nor have I
been able to find anything on the OS side.

Is it possible (likely?) that this is being caused by hardware?  I don't
know if it is actually the bootloader that is causing the delay or if the
kernel is actually being loaded and hangs for some ...
[ message continues ]

This is not what people are saying to you.  people are trying point  
out that your strategy:

1. read the official docs
2. read some other docs
3. pick and choose which to follow
4. come to the official support forum and ask for help ( instead of  
asking the guy who's advice you followed )

is selfish.

you're asking people to volunteer to help you after ignoring the  
resources that they have ( again, voluntarily and for free ) provided  

Ben

[ message continues ]

Have you done a full burn-in overnight memtest?

--ropers

[ message continues ]

Hi Ryan,

You may or may not have a hardware problem, or something else. I think 
in all fairness people tried to help you. What was pointed out to you a 
few times, Linux != OpenBSD and reading the FaQ on OpenBSD and all are 
very valid point. No offense intended by anyone here really. But just 
look at it this way.

- The FAQ point out not to use root bigger then 504MB in some old case, 
witch may not apply to you.

http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq14.html#LargeDrive

You use 10GB.

- The FAQ does point out that boot.conf is not required and you use one.
http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq6.html#PXE

- The FAQ said not to asked for help if you don't use the generic BSD 
and there ins't any need for custom kernel and you built your own from 
cvs, not even trying the snapshots one.

http://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq5.html#WhySrc

- You said no explain of your problem was on google, but a very quick 
search show differently.

http://archives.neohapsis.com/archives/openbsd/2005-01/2830.html

- You said you read the documentations, but you refer and justify it by 
pointing to openbsd101.com

- You explain that your system works with your setup on Linux, so there 
isn't any reason it wouldn't work on OpenBSD.

"I have had no problems with a larger bootable partition with Linux".

And a few more.

Again Ryan, I am not trying to dig a hole under you at all. I am really 
trying to help you and a few others as well did.

But all that we see if many and even recurring Linux behaviors,  not 
what's expected with OpenBSD to fist read the FAQ and then follow their 
details and if all fails, then asked for help.

When asked, each times, it doesn't follow the OpenBSD way and even try 
to justify it to others as it's OK with Linux, so it should be OK here.

But all these pitfall have been seen time and time again and a lots of 
people are more then welling to help you, but at the same time, none 
want to waste their time on the same old issues that may apply.

That's why all these ...
[ message continues ]